Curse

kazjun · Oct 02, 2006, 04:30 AM // 04:30

Hi,
I'm a warrior by trade and the only casters I run are necros.
I have been planning on making a mesmer to get a better feel for them and with the hero system of nightfall I want to get some more knowledge about them.
The question is, is fast cast worth it? I intend to take a interrupt hero, and with the AI having godlike reflexes and most interrupt skills having like .25 cast time, would fast cast be useful? Would he be better than say a necro primary hero with erys vasburg's skill bar? Soul reaping rules in pve, and even an ele's energy storage is good. I know that mesmers got plenty of skills that steal energy so energy shouldn't be too hardpressed, but still...
Does fast cast make that big of a difference in pve? Is it useful?

Redfeather1975 · Oct 02, 2006, 04:36 AM // 04:36

So far I've mainly used fast casting if my secondary has long casting spells. As you said mesmer spells are generally very fast on their own!
The biggest draw I can see is using Mantra of Recovery and Power Return with fast casting. You become a non-domination interrupting machine and the advantage of Mantra of Recovery will go well with any secondary spell caster's spells.
With a high enough fast casting attribute, Mantra of Recovery and Power Return will become a huge headache to caster's. You may become the hot target quickly in a battle!

Edit: I only wish that Nightfall offered more fast casting abilities. I think the motivation to use that attribute would boost mesmer popularity some.

kazjun · Oct 02, 2006, 04:59 AM // 04:59

Hi,
thanks, I'll try that out. My knowledge of mesmers is pretty much erys vasburg and the slew of anti warrior stuff I get hit with. I also use physical resist and ele resist when farming sometimes with my warrior though. Good hydras. Otherwise I just see the interrupts and inspiration to keep energy up on my necro. Good for SS, cause energy is really taxed with echoed SS's and mobs die at the same time so you can't really reap much energy for SR. Though I use the standard SS build for UW.

Yeah, I know your pain. Necro's had no soul reaping skills till factions, though they've given us a few now (5). I think mesmer fast cast gets quite a few skills in nightfall don't they?

Redfeather1975 · Oct 02, 2006, 07:57 AM // 07:57

Aye, they get a few new ones that are good for signet users especially.
But when I look at all the new Spawning Power ones in Nightfall, I am very jealous.

lightblade · Oct 02, 2006, 08:00 AM // 08:00

The faster you cast, the faster you recharge, and the faster you do kill.

Terra Xin · Oct 02, 2006, 10:21 AM // 10:21

Apart from Knockdown, Casting is the only time where you remain idle (and are therefore most vulnerable). Your ability to cut down that idle time becomes very important. FC also gives you the edge of pre-emptive strike, allowing you to gain the advantage right at the start.

lightblade · Oct 02, 2006, 04:12 PM // 16:12

There are downsides to fast cast. I don't know if you guys notice this or not. Once the casting time of a certain spell (or skill, not sure) drop below 1 second, it became impossible to cancel it. Yet, it still can be interrupted by your enemy.

Redfeather1975 · Oct 02, 2006, 04:55 PM // 16:55

With proper energy management skills, fast casting allows a mesmer to heal more or do more damage than some may give them credit for. Especially if you have Mantra of Recovery up all the time.

Ry Dia · Oct 02, 2006, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by lightblade

There are downsides to fast cast. I don't know if you guys notice this or not. Once the casting time of a certain spell (or skill, not sure) drop below 1 second, it became impossible to cancel it. Yet, it still can be interrupted by your enemy.

Yes you can. Use the cancel action key, default mapping is Esc I believe.

kazjun · Oct 03, 2006, 12:55 AM // 00:55

But is it worth sinking lots of points into? I'm focusing mainly on quick spells,
1 sec cast or so and the interrupts are like .25 secs. Is there a point where it's not as useful to sink attrib points into? I mean, you can cast like lightning, but that puts severe strain on energy so you need to devote skills to energy management, where as you can go mesmer secondary and maybe not cast as fast, but still fast, and maybe not need the energy management skills so you can take an extra interrupt or defense skill?

Redfeather1975 · Oct 03, 2006, 01:24 AM // 01:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by kazjun

But is it worth sinking lots of points into? I'm focusing mainly on quick spells,
1 sec cast or so and the interrupts are like .25 secs. Is there a point where it's not as useful to sink attrib points into? I mean, you can cast like lightning, but that puts severe strain on energy so you need to devote skills to energy management, where as you can go mesmer secondary and maybe not cast as fast, but still fast, and maybe not need the energy management skills so you can take an extra interrupt or defense skill?

I would say it's not worth putting points into if you aren't using any fast casting abilities and the spells you are using already have a activation of less than 1 second. It's also useful if you have armour with + bonus on spell activation.

Carth` · Oct 03, 2006, 06:15 AM // 06:15

Personally I love fast casting. It's the whole reason for making a mesmer isn't it? Otherwise a secondary could do the mesmer's job. When I use mesmer skills as a secondary mesmer I'm always amazed how long they take to cast. Most of them are 2 or 3 seconds, and I'm used to them being virtually instant when using a mesmer.

For example Backfire... this is a 3 second cast!

ANet makes skills disadvantaged based on a primary, for example:

Ele skills are very expensive - they have lots of energy.
Ranger skills are more expensive than warrior or assassin etc (some are 15-25e) - they have expertise.
Mesmer skills take longer to cast than they should for what they do - they have fast casting.

kazjun · Oct 04, 2006, 05:04 AM // 05:04

True enough I guess, though I tend to favour cast times around 1 sec anyway. Comes from starting as a warrior, any attack that takes like 3 secs to cast has to do massive damage or shut down, else it's too long. Only times I have spells like that long are my MM skills, and you got the boots for that. I tried an ele (a noob fire ele so maybe its not a good example) but their cast times...
I swear, even if you don't get interrupted, the damage is just sad for the time and energy spent. I'm tempted to try a M/E but I'll have to practice my energy management cause even if you cast faster, the energy cost is still heavy.

lightblade · Oct 04, 2006, 07:36 AM // 07:36

Too much FC doesn't work.

But any mesmer primary that have no FC is total n00b...

LightningHell · Oct 04, 2006, 07:46 AM // 07:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by lightblade

Too much FC doesn't work.

Excluding the now-dead Airspike Me/Es.

Hollerith · Oct 04, 2006, 02:32 PM // 14:32

I always have 8-10 unless I'm doing something that requires more/less (ie, signets or MoR stuff).

kazjun · Oct 17, 2006, 04:45 AM // 04:45

Thanks all for the tips. I'll probably stick to about 9 FC I think. Anyway, my new mes is just finishing up with Ascalon, so I'll probably just stick to doing primary quests and missions till I get to LA. Then I'll head over to Kaineng to level to 20 and get some more skills and a few elites to experiment with. But then I'll probably take a break to play through nightfall with my warrior.

Redfeather1975 · Oct 17, 2006, 04:55 AM // 04:55

Kazjun, try to get your mesmer to Nightfall also, as the Signet of Illusion is going to create so much potential in builds I'm sure you'll find it very fun to play.

Thom Bangalter · Oct 17, 2006, 07:58 AM // 07:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redfeather1975

With a high enough fast casting attribute, Mantra of Recovery and Power Return will become a huge headache to caster's. You may become the hot target quickly in a battle!

mesmers are always a high priority target in builds, if you're playing defensively you put your mesmers on their mesmers.

On topic, fast casting is an interesting primary attribute skill: it doesn't really do anything for you straight up, but certain skills certainly benefit from having a respectable investment in it (diversion comes to mind almost immediately, and really anything that's more than a 1 second cast). It's no expertise, and arguably worse than energy storage due to exhaustion mechanics, but it's stronger than strength (though that's not saying a lot) and at the very least, you can have fun with it (fast cast stone daggers is a lot of fun in HA). If you're running a lot of hexes though and decide to dip into the curses or blood line, though, you'll be amazed how much difference 9 and 0 fast casting make, not to mention the rezmer so common in balanced builds.

Avarre · Oct 17, 2006, 11:30 AM // 11:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Excluding the now-dead Airspike Me/Es.

It's not dead, just not as powerful (significantly so).

But since this is a thread of PvE... fc element was never that great here.